865: LIVE From Ellucian Live 2024 - w/ David Cone⁠, CIO, ⁠Faye Kilday⁠, Dean, Makala Maple, Registrar, & Julie Kosch, Application Systems Analyst, Northeast Community College

Joe Sallustio: Welcome back, everybody. It's your time to up on the EdUp Experience podcast, where we make education your business. I've been ambushed here - ambushed by a group of amazing community college professionals, ambushed in a good way. This, of course, is Dr. Joe Sallustio doing my, I don't know how many podcasts, the fifth of the day, fourth of the day, talking to amazing leaders in and around higher education. You might ask, where am I doing this? Well, I'm here at Ellucian Live in San Antonio, Texas with 5,800 or 6,000 of my closest colleagues. It is very, very busy. A lot of information being exchanged, a lot of technology talk, generative AI, what the future's going to look like, FAFSA, what the heck is that about? There's a whole lot going on. And as I said, I've got four people around me right now and two that were like, "No, we're good," but maybe we'll call them in in a minute and get on the mic. We'll figure it out.

So we're going to go around one by one. Tell us who you are and what you do and the name of your institution.

David Cone: Well, thanks for having us. We're from Northeast Community College in Northeast Nebraska. My name is David Cone. I'm the new CIO there. It's a privilege to work with these folks and be a part of this. We're excited to be part of the solution for a lot of things. Technology services has a unique role in education and we have a great institution to work with. So, we're excited to hear all the new things that Ellucian's doing and have a great team. We have 14 people that came from our institution.

Joe Sallustio: 14 people?

David Cone: So, we will come back with a wealth of knowledge to take some good next steps.

Joe Sallustio: Wow, all right.

Faye Kilday: I'm Faye Kilday and I'm the Dean for the Center for Excellence in Teaching and Learning at Northeast and really just the junk drawer. I do everything that nobody else wants to do. Assessment, yeah.

Joe Sallustio: Assessment. See, whenever you talk to somebody who's doing assessment, their eyes get really wide. Like, "Yes, I love it." Right. I go, assessment. You know, but if you say podcasting, my eyes will get wide. Right. So much respect for what you do, teaching and learning. Obviously important. We can talk about technology all day long, but it comes down to how students are receiving information, whether they're showing that they're learning. So thank you for being here and we'll talk more.

Michaela Maple: Yes, and I am Michaela Maple. I am the registrar at Northeast. I wear many hats actually. I oversee the admissions office as well as registration, testing center, and we have a department that oversees our international students, global opportunities, and travel opportunities outside of the country.

Joe Sallustio: So again, you oversee all that and your title's registrar?

Michaela Maple: Yeah.

Joe Sallustio: Yikes! We need to get you a new title, whoever the president is over there at Northeast. That's crazy. All right.

Julie Kosch: Hello, I am Julie Kosch. I am an application systems analyst in our technology services department. And I am just excited. We're learning a lot here at the Ellucian Live. And I'm excited about the upcoming product release.

Joe Sallustio: Did you guys get the product release stuff? Has that happened yet?

Julie Kosch: Well, it's all week. It's hard to pinpoint what's out there, what's new, what's coming, what's already available that you haven't been using.

Joe Sallustio: You know, I think it's important to set the stage as we talk about community colleges here in general are just so unique in this day and age and not that they haven't been before. But I feel like there's a new positive light put on community colleges as we talk more about post-secondary education rather than higher education. Community colleges are offering alternative pathways and certificate programs, short-term credentials and the longer-term credentials and credit, dual credit and transfer pathways and mental health services and food pantries and so on. So the job doesn't get easier, it gets harder. Can you guys talk just a little bit about how your institution has evolved over the last couple years? By the way, generative AI and technology - I mean, so you look at all those things that the community college has to deal with and serving a diverse student body that's one bill away from quitting a lot of times. We'll start with you David. There's so much to keep track of to move an institution forward these days. How's it going?

David Cone: Sure. Well, my perspective is fairly new and we're very much in the technology piece but there have been a lot of things our institution has been looking at in the last couple of years. I'll let Faye speak more to this but we're on a guided pathways initiative to really help ourselves refocus on our entire student population. There are things that we do really well that every school does well and we're well suited to do those but there are opportunities to improve that student experience for all of our students and you hit the nail on the head with the community colleges - there's all phases of life that we impact. It's not your traditional student. And to try to do all that well is a challenge. So what are the things we really have to focus on so we're meeting those needs and I'll let you guys speak to it. But it's certainly a challenge but a ton of opportunity and we have a really committed institution to identifying, clearly defining what success looks like because it's a moving target as well. How are we going to do this? And sometimes when you make some success it breeds other success.

Faye Kilday: So in addition to community college, we're a comprehensive rural community college. For that, what I mean is we cover - it takes you about four and a half hours to cover 16 counties to get from one end to the other. We have extended campus locations, extensive dual credit, and so we are serving a very large region of Nebraska. And so that alone presents its own challenges. And as David mentioned, Guided Pathways has been a focus for the last five years for our institution, really focusing on the needs of our region. Student success drives everything we do, that's our mission. And so all of the work we've done has really focused on how can we get students to achieve their goal. And that might be a college degree, or it might just be workforce upskilling, getting to the workforce, and living in a wage that, earning a living wage to help provide for their family. And so that's everything we've been working on focuses on that.

Joe Sallustio: Amazing. You know one of the things I love about what you said is a lot of people when they think community colleges don't understand that you're an economic engine as much as you are an educational institution. If you ripped community colleges out of the rural area that they serve there would be just decimation among earnings and outcomes and so on but you have to do a lot of things right. You have to serve the student but at the same time you have to put in the right tech to do it. You have to protect data. You have to write the right systems. You have to move the business forward.

Can the tech folks here talk for a second and then we'll come back to those serving the student? We're facing - what are you learning here? What are you here for? Is it the collegiality, the networking, the newness of new technology? From your perspective, Julie, when you go home, what's success?

Julie Kosch: Well, for me, well, in the last year, last year we moved to the cloud. We migrated to the cloud, so we're no longer on premise. And that was super easy, right?

Joe Sallustio: Was like, we'll just go to the cloud. No?

Julie Kosch: Could have been worse. It was all right. We had a good team, and we have great users, good functional users. But I think for me, I'm really focused on what we can do to help our employees, our functional users, to allow for the student success, complete our mission and our goals. So what can we do? So I work a lot with integrations. We have a lot of other applications that are tied to our banner system, and I'm excited about what I'm learning here as far as insights and data connect. I think that is in our near future and I think it'll help allow us to help our functional users. It's been good because moving to the cloud, because we've been able to focus more on the future now besides previously when we had to focus on keeping the lights on and keeping things working where now we can focus more on projects in the future.

Joe Sallustio: Nailed it. One thing you said that a lot of people don't understand and I don't say a lot of people don't understand, there's a lot that goes into it, is the word integration. There are so many systems and so many points of data. And just because you have like an ERP doesn't mean that magically everything works. You have to pull in Google information and information from your CRM and information from your advancement. I mean, there could be an ecosystem of integrations that go around your system. But I don't think that that's well known.

Julie Kosch: Right, it's not and recently actually Jen Gleason in our department, she put together this great visual of basically, Banner -

Joe Sallustio: Is this Jen right?

Julie Kosch: That is Jen. Shout out to Jen Gleason. She put, it's really great. It's a good visual showing our whole college, our users, each other, what it reminds us what we have. It's big. There's a lot of systems tied to Banner.

Joe Sallustio: Who the heck manages that sucker right? It's a big ecosystem.

David Cone: Yeah. So there was some, there's some moment of, you know, there's an epiphany or just like 14 people are going to go and start changing things, which is also cool. Well, we're committed to working with Ellucian and happy to be investing in the things that Ellucian is investing in. So it's worth our time to be here and see what's next and what's out there and how we can best use our systems that we already have, right? So we want to be good stewards of those resources. That's one of our big mission things.

The hard part about technology services is that we're kind of in a weird spot, right? We don't get to work with students in the same way. And so a lot of times our impact is very much tied to processes or integrations. But there's a huge opportunity for us to really engage in the core mission of the institution. And that's something I'm excited to help as we get closer maybe to some of the processes and get a chance to revisit some of the way things have always worked, sometimes you kind of are what you are. You've been that way for a long time. With all the new that's coming out with Ellucian, we talk about really pivoting from being an infrastructure-focused to now innovation-focused. And that's a new opportunity for us to really work with our users who get to directly impact students, but also to get our whole technology services team engaged with the mission. Sometimes you can do technology services the same thing we do, we could do for any industry. What is it unique about doing technology services for a community college? And really getting our people on mission excited about that. Because yes, we do technology stuff. How do we do technology stuff?

Joe Sallustio: I love it. I mean, across the board, right? So integrations, but simple like networking, all this stuff that no one sees until it breaks. But that's critical to the success of an institution. So how do we really celebrate the fact that we are on mission and doing what we do? That's good, right? Because it is that I love that you said like that, because I'm like, yes, I love somebody that says we do technology stuff. I understand that.

There are a lot of technical, there's a lot of technicality around technology and you look at the student facing jobs and you guys are representative of a couple of key groups that typically fight change. Faculty and the registrar. Not you in particular, but registrars can have very specific ways of doing things, especially if they've worked in the system over years and years and of course scheduling.

What's not represented in a group like yours is financial aid, because you always have to follow the money around, because then the credits don't work. And if the credits don't work, the registrar's like, the hair is coming out left and right, because everything follows the credit. Can you talk about change, change management a little bit, because you're here learning about technology, or learning about how to go back with that technology and implement change. Is it a change culture that you have? Do you have to change manage it? Give me a little bit of what you're looking at.

Michaela Maple: I think we just understand that in the role of education, things are always changing. My team is used to change. We're implementing, we're in the process of implementing recruit and advise right now. We're about to launch a document management system and things are never the same. My job, no two days are ever the same. So I am used to change. You know, I think it's, from my perspective, it's interesting, you know, David's bringing this large group to Ellucian Live. If I were him, I'd be scared because we're all gonna come back and be talking about these great products we saw and when can we implement this? When can we bring this to Northeast? He's gonna have a big list coming his way.

Joe Sallustio: Ooh, he's building coalitions though at the same time. Smart move.

Michaela Maple: Yeah, yeah. So this conference is great. It's always exciting just to learn from other schools but to also see all the technology that's out there. Like I said, we know things are going to change. If we can stay on top of it and just get our teams to buy into that, we're doing everything that we do for the student. We want to make the student experience the best that it can be and I think Northeast is really good about being so student focused. Our mission is student success and I think if you asked anybody that worked at Northeast, they would agree if we're making change for the student then we're doing the right thing.

Joe Sallustio: Tell them like it is. Alright, Faye, what do you have to add from the faculty perspective?

Faye Kilday: So we recently, as part of our Guided Pathways, overhauled all of our curriculum and it took us a while and we're a little behind schedule so people like Michaela love us because we're putting through changes and coming to Ellucian Live and having - we brought a faculty member even, helping the rest of us understand how we're so intertwined and it's great for a faculty committee to make a change and we know that it happens and next year it's great. Students are taking those classes, but we don't always recognize all of the changes that have to happen for the registrar, for financial aid, and all the things that they have to do, and even technology services are reporting. And so this experience for all of us has been great because we can start to understand what role each of us plays and how that's important that we are all in it together and we don't leave anybody out so that when we're implementing these changes, it's done right and students are able to then see the fruits of our labor and be successful.

Joe Sallustio: That's a fact. That's a fact.

David Cone: I'm going to just piggyback. You mentioned that there's some resistance to change. This is what's great about our team is that I'm not terrified to bring a whole group. Now it wasn't even my idea to bring all this group, so I don't get any credit for that. But our institution is committed to doing what's best for students. And you can look at just Michaela's calendar, the amount of time that she's spent working with us on new projects, and the amount of manual work that Faye and her team have done to help us fix problems, is a real commitment to doing things right. So as a technology team, we love having these kind of functional users that will help us make a difference because we can't champion stuff as a technology service. Sometimes we're required and we have to help bridge the gap and translate, but really we don't have the problems to solve. So we love having great partners. And Julie mentioned that we have great functional users, but we really have business partners across the institution that really make our job as technology fun because we can move the needle. And the better we get at prioritizing this and setting the vision ahead will give us better work to do down the road. So sometimes you're chasing things in the past. But great thing about being here is I hope they come back with a great list because some of this stuff is easy to do. But it takes someone who wants to do it. And we can't champion that from technology services the same way as we can and Faye and Michaela want it. That means something to us to hear from them.

Joe Sallustio: You know what AI has done for all of us in higher education in any industry, it's taken us from looking outside-in to inside-out, right? Where we were just, like as a CIO, trying to make everything work. You're trying to make sure that the data is protected. You're trying to make sure that functionally in the institution, everything is right. Same thing faculty, the create, and registrar, all the way around. Now it's like, okay, wait a minute. Simultaneously, I have to look at what's coming. How is this going to enhance my job? How is faculty going to react? Right, just faculty reactions to AI across institutions is completely different. If I'm building systems, how can AI augment my build? So it's taken all of us and turned us into futurists. How do you balance this going forward? You guys think about - I mean, that's probably the hardest question I've asked all week just from the regular.

David Cone: Well, Faye's done a lot of talking about AI with our institution. I thought today's presentation was great because sometimes we don't know the questions to ask about AI, right? Like, how can AI help me? Well, no. Let's clearly define a problem and see how AI can help with that. And so the more specific you can get, the more chance you have of being successful. So that was good feedback for me to hear because you hear the tag AI thrown to everything. But really, it's really ambiguous. So it's been great this week to hear a couple. Here's an example of how this could work.

Joe Sallustio: And me, AI is not specific enough, Exactly.

David Cone: And sometimes the comment about Excel, you're going to be using AI without knowing it. Well, that's almost not helpful. It will improve it. But there are times, we're as solution people, how can we implement AI in a way that will make a difference? So there's opportunities there, but we need almost to learn how to talk and think about it. So it's good to be here and see some concrete examples.

Joe Sallustio: Faye, what have you been seeing? You have a lot to say on this.

Faye Kilday: Yep. As you can imagine, when ChatGPT came out, it was like the sky was falling. And so our initial reaction at CETL was of course to, okay, remember the calculator folks. It's really okay. We're going to be okay. And so over the last year, we've done a lot of workshops and people have really grown and understand the tools. Most of it is just making people get their hands dirty and their feet wet, jump in and use it. And so now we're to a point where there's a comfort level where we can start to establish our institutional policies around it. What does it really mean at Northeast? What does it mean for our students? What does it mean for us as staff so that we're making sure we're using it ethically? And then also as products come out, understanding what it does, how it works, and really understanding it before we jump in and buy something or say it's the answer to everything. As an institution, it's been a really fun evolution. And I was just telling David, I feel like we've moved a long ways. And I finally feel like people are, instead of panic initially, they're starting to ask questions instead of freaking out.

Joe Sallustio: I bet you it's good validation to be here and talk to colleagues that go, yeah, we're not even close to that yet. And you go, yeah, that's it. We're kind of, right? Or yeah, they're changing too, right? And for you too, Michaela, if you think about AI can enhance - AI programs that might be able to enhance the work of a registrar and make the job of registrar a lot easier. I'd be interested in that.

Michaela Maple: Wow, yeah. You just blew my mind there because I, you know, quite honestly, I haven't tapped into AI much or even the, you know, what the possibilities are. That's a great thought. Hadn't considered, so.

Joe Sallustio: It's my only thought, although my only great thought I'm going to have.

Michaela Maple: Well, I appreciate that you pointed it in my direction.

Joe Sallustio: Well, no, I think it right because I oversee the registrar function at my university and I'm always going, okay, how could we make it so these classes get inputted easier or tracked easier? The DPA, degree progress audits. I mean, all of that can be AI generated transcript evals. Like if you could automate and use AI around transcript eval, so you could turn around a transcript evaluation in 24 hours without involving faculty. Now you're talking like you're talking like skipping the intro on Netflix. Like that's - you're getting to that point, right? So that's anyway, so I start riffing on what the possibilities - we should talk.

Michaela Maple: We should talk. I'm up for it.

Joe Sallustio: How about you, Julie, anything that you're looking for AI in your job? I mean, you're going to have a bot next to you creating programs?

Julie Kosch: You know, before today I hadn't really thought about it too much honestly either so I'm like Michaela but today seeing the session this morning and what it can all do is really impressive. I probably haven't put as much thought in it besides a ChatGPT and using that here and there so it is exciting definitely.

Joe Sallustio: What else you guys want to say about Northeast and your institution, your time here at Ellucian, the conference? Take us home one at a time. We'll go backwards to sign. Julie, you start.

Julie Kosch: Me first. It's great. It's great having this much, these many representatives from our institution here together and collaborating together. I am excited as well to talk afterwards and see what everybody has taken away from it. That's a fun part. So far, I mean, we've had some discussions so far, after today, it's a great time to get away with each other and learn.

Joe Sallustio: Yeah and the dinners that you get to go to and the lunches where you get to share ideas, that's worth its weight in gold for the institutions that send one person to a conference like this. You know when you invest in people they invest back, right? Michaela, what are your takeaways?

Michaela Maple: Northeast really does promote professional development and the fact that they were willing to send 14 - would have sent more in fact -

Joe Sallustio: You know, somebody's got to run things over there.

Michaela Maple: They do, they do, and yesterday was the first day of registration for the fall so maybe not the best time to be gone but I have a great team that can take care of it back home so that I can be here learning great things because there's so much opportunity that Ellucian provides so I'm glad to be here, learned a lot and I'm excited for the rest of the conference.

Faye Kilday: So we are moving into the next phase of our strategic plan and so this group that is with us at Ellucian Live, 14 people, I feel like are - once we have those strategic priorities set we're going to be the ones that drive the work forward and make sure the next five years are as exciting as the last five years and so all of the things we've learned really are setting us up for where we're going to be in five years and that is super exciting that our institution is willing to invest in that and recognizes the value that creating this class or cross collaboration is so critical and having key stakeholders so very excited.

Joe Sallustio: Last word.

David Cone: You know I'm excited for this conference but I'm looking at Faye and Michaela here - they're heading to rural guided pathways the next couple days and HLC conference so they're here and somewhere else so there's a big commitment to what we can learn from one another and to stay professionally engaged and growing so the last session I walked out of and I just had this moment of - you know, two years ago we came to Ellucian Live in Denver and man it's a different world now with Ellucian than it was two years ago and so kind of had this stop and think what will it look like two years from now? Our world has changed a ton in those same two years but there's a whole lot coming in the next year or two that - what are we gonna be doing and what kind of questions are we gonna ask? I mean what kind of answers are we gonna have for your AI question in two years? Yeah, so there are things that will happen and it's just a kind of stark two-year period and just the things that Ellucian was talking about two years ago, they're not even talking about now. It's brand new stuff.

Joe Sallustio: How quickly - I imagine if you came on the podcast, I was there two years ago in Denver too, and it took you guys two years to get on the podcast. We'll have to see what happens two years from now.

David Cone: Well, you know what? This is why it's fun to have these opportunities.

Joe Sallustio: Now you're comfortable. Now you'll be on, "Hey, Joe, get me on." You know, we'll get you on. What a pleasure for you guys to be here. Really an honor to talk to you all. Ladies and gentlemen, they are the team from Northeast Community College - David, Faye, Michaela, and Julie. We will not go through their titles again if you listen to the beginning of the episode for all that. Hope you guys had fun. Thank you guys for talking about this.

Well, there you have it, everybody. Let's outro this episode. Be excellent to each other. You just ed upped.