820: LIVE from ⁠InsightsEDU⁠ 2024 - with Matthew Loonam, Senior Account Executive-Education Vertical, LinkedIn

Joe Sallustio: Welcome back, everybody. It's your time to up on the EdUp Experience podcast where we continue to make education your business. I say continue because this is my 12th episode of the day. I think maybe 13th. I've been talking all day, but I've been waiting for this guest. He was supposed to join me earlier in the day but he had some travel concerns. I think he's leaving, but we had to pin him down. In fact, I think somebody from Education Dynamics might have physically tackled him to get him here and I don't joke about that.

Matthew Loonam: This is true. I was tackled to be here, but I'm very excited. 

Joe Sallustio: You hear his voice. He's got a lot to say. But before I tell you who he is, I want to remind everybody we're here at Insights EDU, a conference hosted by Education Dynamics, all about marketing and enrollment for the online student. They put out an incredible report this morning with insights for the online college student and what's happening in marketing enrollment. I suggest that you download it the minute that you get a chance so you can get the insights that can help you make better decisions with your money to reach students. We're going to talk all about reaching students today with this guest. Here he is. He's Matt Loonam. He is senior account executive for education at LinkedIn, my favorite social media platform. Matthew, what's going on?

Matthew Loonam: How are we doing, Joe? And by the way, very impressive that this is either 12 or 13 on the day. You're still high on spirits. You still got a lot left in the engine.

Joe Sallustio: I don't know about that. You're coming across as still having a lot. So that's a plus.

Matthew Loonam: Well, I hear that there's like a cocktail hour coming up. So there is something that's keeping me motivated right now.

Joe Sallustio: We all need the carrot on the stick. That's it. Cheers. I'll get ready for some of that. So LinkedIn, if you're listening to this podcast and you're not on LinkedIn, shame. That's just silly. It's just silly. LinkedIn is where we network. Interestingly enough, the most important part about LinkedIn showed itself during the pandemic - that you could still network online virtually and have incredible relationships with people, do that still and then go meet them in person now. Talk about your role serving higher education via LinkedIn.

Matthew Loonam: Sure. So I've been on the higher education team probably going on five years at this point. At LinkedIn close to six years. It's interesting. I've been in digital media close to 18 years. It's been great to become part of the education vertical really because it's been amazing. And the reason for that is, you know, since 2020 and COVID, the whole education world has been like thrown in the air. How are we going to navigate this? Right. So to be a part of that and its evolution has been a great experience overall. 

And to your point, one, if you're not on LinkedIn yet, that's crazy. You gotta get that done. But what we kind of highlight to clients all the time is, when someone is on LinkedIn, they're career-focused, they're thinking about where they can get ahead in their current role or maybe switching that. And the reason that higher education has been such a grower within LinkedIn is that's just a natural bridge for both of those scenarios I said. You have three or five years experience, you're looking to get ahead, you're looking at VPs or directors and what education they have, how do I replicate that? Right. Or if you want to get into a new industry, how do you do that? You upskill, whether that's through a degree or short-form certificate. So it's been a perfect fit for LinkedIn as a whole.

Joe Sallustio: Earlier today, somebody said, can I get your business card? And I said, LinkedIn is my business card.

Matthew Loonam: Yeah, that's a fact. That's a fact.

Joe Sallustio: It's the truth, right? That's your living, breathing resume.

Matthew Loonam: Yes, of course.

Joe Sallustio: So as we talk about higher education, you talked about the marriage, so to speak of education, professional, LinkedIn, we do know that schools put a lot of focus and a lot of money in advertising on LinkedIn, particularly in graduate programs, right? Because you're working, you might have a bachelor's degree and here along comes an institution that says, you know, get your graduate degree. Maybe I am interested. It's going to do this, let me check out this other person who has a graduate degree, they place themselves in this area, present themselves in this area. So not only do you get on LinkedIn, the pathway to get yourself educated by getting notifications from all these schools that are out there. But you get to look at other people in your industry and their credentials to figure out how they place themselves on their elevating career path.

Matthew Loonam: So there's a comparison set. How did they get there? You know, what's their timeline of education? And you said that perfectly - you're taking a little bit of the guesswork out by being able to see how people got in their roles, maybe the certificates that they're taking. I know for me, I'm someone who takes advantage of even LinkedIn Learning where I'll take courses on, you know, sales tactics or whatever is relevant to my job role. And that's a great leading indicator for other people that might be following me to see that I'm investing in myself by trying to hone my craft.

Joe Sallustio: By the way, you said that I said that perfectly. And I just want to let you know I am the smartest man alive.

Matthew Loonam: I've been waiting to use that one all day. If that's the first time that Adam Sandler's made a visit on this podcast, then that's a win for me.

Joe Sallustio: That's my - if you ask my son who he wants to be, he says Adam Sandler.

Matthew Loonam: Amazing. Why I'm not really sure.

Joe Sallustio: Happy Gilmore. Well, so I allowed him to watch an Adam Sandler movie, got scolded by the wife for that. But we had a good moment while watching it.

Matthew Loonam: So that's all that I know about getting scolded by the wife or letting your kid watch some movies. I gotta be the cool dad. Marvel movies like the whole bit. I get it.

Joe Sallustio: Going back to LinkedIn. LinkedIn Learning is important. And I like the piece of it where you get the credential and now I'm going to put up my certificate on LinkedIn and let everybody else know I got it. The organic nature of that, I took something I'm going to let you know is still something we can touch and feel and show. What isn't shown and you're talking about it today with your colleagues from the other companies is that AI is all the rage, right? Everybody wants to talk about AI, everybody wants to talk about what AI can do, how it can do it faster, how it can do it better. But there is still a personal part to this in this business that we do. Can you talk a little bit about that? From your view, what do we need to keep our eyes on in a world that is going to be AI coming at us from all angles?

Matthew Loonam: Yeah, it's a great question. You know, I think a lot of the talk on AI makes you go to robots are gonna be doing your job, right? And I don't look at it through that lens. I look at it through, it's just another efficiency lever that you can pull, right? So like when we're mentioning how we're talking to prospective students or we're talking to our university partners, like how we can better communicate. Wouldn't you like to know that maybe the person isn't in market now that you had another conversation?

So we're enabling universities to better understand who their potential student is with AI. It doesn't mean that how people communicate is gonna change because I do think efficiency through AI also needs a Matt or a Joe to say, hey, do we have this right? You know, are we -

Joe Sallustio: Matt.

Matthew Loonam: Well, because don't forget the AI is powered by data. So if you're giving your AI false data or data that's not compelling, you're not going to get compelling results, right? That's where the human element comes in. And at least for now, we're a very necessary part to ensure that you're getting the best results.

Joe Sallustio: You're a Brazilian steakhouse. Yes. Green for me, red for now. It would be interesting for LinkedIn to put like a little toggle open education closed for education.

Matthew Loonam: Well, we do have those signals you have to open to work, right? And it's funny, we do have segments that are open to education as well.

Joe Sallustio: Really? Okay.

Matthew Loonam: And, you know, because again, we know that communicating with people in the manner in which they want to be spoken to has that much more of an impact, right? You don't want to hear about, you know, using open work as an example, you don't want to hear from recruiters or talent or HR incessantly if you're very happy in your job, right? So there goes back to the efficiency question, would they rather know, am I wasting my time here? It goes to the same thing with open to education. If we know you're consuming other content and it's more behavioral signals, if you're interacting with other schools and we know, hey, you're essentially raising your hand, I'm considering going back to school. Great. We now can say I'm not wasting time by just casting a big net. I'm speaking to the people who are signaling I want to know more.

Joe Sallustio: What do higher ed institutions keep asking you about? How do I market to students better? Is it AI always right now? What are you - when they come to you and say Matt, I need to do this, I need to do that. Do I need more students? And how can you help me? Like, what are those things that are top of mind?

Matthew Loonam: So I think a lot of the questions we get is one, they want to just be aware of the trends. Like, I will tell you, every school wants to know, here are my three biggest competitors. What are they doing that I'm not?

Joe Sallustio: And just for the record, Matt, I'm stealing this sound effect board. I need this in my life.

Matthew Loonam: It's long. They all want to know what the other individual is doing. And really, they use myself and my teammate Elliot Ross to really bounce ideas off of like, hey, this is where we're seeing progress. This is how we're seeing focus. How do you suggest that we communicate. You know, there's a lot of worry about, are we doing this right? You know, there's a lot of choices now. So as I said, in a post-COVID world, you went from there were online education, traditional schools, now you have this intersection where you can be a hybrid of both, right? So how do you get smarter to understand? Okay, is this perfect person? You know, if we're located in California, should we be trying to recruit people that are on the East Coast, right? Or should we stay within our realm? 

And it's cliche, but it's worth stating that like, we're in an environment that everyone should be testing continually. I tell clients all the time, our latest and greatest, what's working for them. But don't be shy about like every campaign or every procedure doesn't have to be like knock out of the park, right? Because how we communicate with our potential students is showing your want to have them here, right? You're learning more about them. You're communicating more effectively. And I think we're in an environment that you have to constantly be evolving. What worked a year or two ago, like, for example, you know, there was a point in time where every education creative said online, flexible and affordable.

Joe Sallustio: I'll save you the mystery. Everyone is saying that.

Matthew Loonam: You know, what's your value proposition? We're online.

Joe Sallustio: Yeah, exactly. So what you just made the list.

Matthew Loonam: So what I say to everyone is there's something that your institution or what this program does very well. Lean into that. Right? Because that is your differentiator. I can't tell you, this one word is going to be it, whatever you're really good at, make that the best part of your story.

Joe Sallustio: Yeah, lean into and own it, right?

Matthew Loonam: Exactly.

Joe Sallustio: The owning it part is interesting because you know, online, flexible, affordable. It's been done. It might be true for a lot of institutions, but it's for a lot of institutions, right?

Matthew Loonam: Exactly.

Joe Sallustio: So what else helps you connect? You're right. And LinkedIn is all about connections. This is the value proposition of LinkedIn, LinkedIn is a master at creating the opportunity for connections. So how do we better connect with students as an industry in higher ed when the battle for a student - and one of the - I don't know if you saw the report, but one of the things that came out of the report this morning for online college students is a competitor set is reduced where a student before - now it's two. So they're not choosing from many institutions. So you better be really stinking good at marketing and enrollment.

Matthew Loonam: Totally. And what I always say to individuals, you know, back to being smarter of how we communicate is I think what's lost from time to time with our marketing is that schools that are going after prospects think that their paid advertisement is going to tell that story. And we could put a whiteboard up here and there could be a million schools that are advertising currently. And we're making a joke of it. But again, if they're all going to say kind of the same thing, the personality of the school is almost always translated through their website or organic posts on wherever they are. It tells you a little bit about the student life, your alumni network.

Joe Sallustio: It goes beyond the tagline exactly or the impact you're having on your communities, right?

Matthew Loonam: That's the stuff people buy, right? It's not about - you know, there was a time where I'd be speaking to schools and they're like, but we're telling people that look exactly like our students that we have an MBA online. It's like, right. So did 70 other people, right? It's fuzzy math. But what do you do with that? Once they've raised their hands, how do you make that even more efficient? So I think that's what's missed is it's not about telling people what you have. It's personalizing that to make someone say, I want to be a part of that.

Joe Sallustio: Such good insight. You've seen a lot of closures. We've seen a lot of closures in higher ed, schools that are just, you know, you wonder what's the board doing, you're starting to see institutions that - well-known institutions go, we didn't see this $130 million deficit coming our way. And you go, how does that happen? What do you see at LinkedIn for the future of higher ed and where institutions are headed? Are we headed for more mergers, acquisitions, closures? Do you see things turning around? You're talking to so many schools.

Matthew Loonam: Well, it's interesting. This morning, in the opening, someone had addressed this that an individual right now is, I would say less concerned about the school. Like if I - you know, I don't want to date myself too much. But there was a time where it was so important to look at the brand of school that I went to that immediately puts you in - gets my resume right through the -

Joe Sallustio: Exactly like this is the pedigree.

Matthew Loonam: Where I think we're now in an environment that's skill-focused, right? And you can do that a lot quicker, right? You can upskill in certain areas, whether it's through free online courses or, you know, starting with a university of like, hey, I'm not ready to get a four-year degree or two-year degree, but I'm willing because this school or institution spoke to me in a manner that was, I was receptive to and I aligned with what their mission was. And that allows you to kind of try that out. So I think the brands themselves, it just comes down to how you're speaking to your potential audience. Right. So there should be more mergers. Right. And, you know, we'll see how that evolves over time.

Joe Sallustio: Too many companies making glass. Right.

Matthew Loonam: Yeah, exactly. It's like, is there - and what's interesting, this kind of freaks people out when I ask the question, when I say like, well, what do you do really good? Right? What do you do that, that instead of just saying you have the program, what about that program?

Joe Sallustio: And you touched on this before.

Matthew Loonam: I say this to clients all the time. It's the value exchange. If you're able to say to someone, Joe, you get this degree and within a year, your salary will increase by X, you'll have access to this alumni network. And to your point, LinkedIn is a networking thing that once you have that badge of, you know, whether it's upskilling or a degree, you're now able to say, Joe, you went down that path as well. You know, this is how I started my journey. This is where I'm headed. So there's always going to be value in that networking piece.

Joe Sallustio: You know, one of the things that you hit on it, and I just realized, and I wonder why we don't talk more about it, but if you went to an elite institution in the past before social media, you're paying for that network and that network sent your resume through and you ended up at Goldman Sachs or somewhere else working. LinkedIn has leveled the playing field because I can network all across the world. I can - who you know is as important as what you know and who - what is the saying your network is your net worth.

Matthew Loonam: Yes. It is so true.

Joe Sallustio: Yeah, because the people I know and I'm on LinkedIn, literally it's up on my computer 24/7. And I meet people all across the world, especially through this podcast that go, Hey, do you do this? Or Hey, do you know someone? And I'm connecting people left and right. I'm getting services. It has leveled the playing field. So get your education, but network because if you don't, you're done.

Matthew Loonam: And I do think I've seen that evolve as well is that I think there was a moment in time where everyone you see you were kind of connected. Maybe you met for one second, like there's that ongoing joke that you see those memes that you meet a couple on a vacation and then you spend the next 20 years being like, that random couple I met on a Tuesday, I just had another child, right? I think people are going to serve themselves better by really protecting their network. Meaning before, you know, 15 years ago, you accepted everything. But do you know who those people are? Right?

Joe Sallustio: Right.

Matthew Loonam: So I think the smart way to build a network is really say, do I want to connect with this person? Or can they enhance my value? Because I as you can imagine even being at LinkedIn, get a lot of, you know, I could probably recite the email that I get in seven different ways. Like, Hey, Matt, your background is really interesting to me. Would you like to have a business conversation on? You know, something absurd like that.

Joe Sallustio: That's not what you want. Right?

Matthew Loonam: No, what that doesn't help you is really not helping that person. Right?

Joe Sallustio: So when I send you the connection later and ask you to have a paragraph on why, hey, I'm the guy that kept hitting me. This conversation.

Matthew Loonam: Yeah, exactly.

Joe Sallustio: The truth of the matter is, and I love to hear it from you on LinkedIn is an amazing platform. Your insights are incredible. I'm going to give a quick shout out here to all the LinkedIn warriors.

Matthew Loonam: I've been holding that one by the way that's - I'm glad I was part of that.

Joe Sallustio: Are you?

Matthew Loonam: Yeah, I'm glad I thought you might be that's - that's an all-time classic right there.

Joe Sallustio: He's ever made.

Matthew Loonam: Yeah. Well, I wouldn't get ridiculous.

Joe Sallustio: I would I would get ridiculous. You could watch it over and over again. The baseball theories of one of the best things ever created. Matt, thanks for coming on today. And being a part of this podcast and LinkedIn. A quick story I'll leave you with. Elvin my partner business partner for this podcast. We met through LinkedIn. Actually, we were connected on referral, we started conversing through LinkedIn, started this business, the podcast business through LinkedIn. In fact, when we wrote our book, which is based on the interviews we've done with 125 presidents before we interviewed another 125, we take the screenshot of our initial LinkedIn conversation to start this podcast. And we stuck it in the book. That was a precipice for this podcast. We didn't meet for almost two full years later in person. So this business was a LinkedIn business. We've since obviously met in person, but that's how it all started via LinkedIn. Isn't that cool?

Matthew Loonam: Very cool. I'm glad to have you on because it kind of helps us close the loop four years later and leave us with some good insights and maybe a cocktail or two on our way to send you on your plane wherever you're going.

Joe Sallustio: Well, look, Joe, it was a pleasure to talk with you. Loved it. You know, next time would love to be on this podcast again.

Joe Sallustio: We would love to have you, ladies and gentlemen, you heard him here at the Insights EDU conference. He is Matt Loonam. He is a senior account executive for education at LinkedIn. Matt, you had a good time?

Matthew Loonam: Had a great time.

Joe Sallustio: Ladies and gentlemen, you've just ed upped.